Unbabbled
Unbabbled
Sarah Ward, M.S., CCC-SLP: Strategies to Support Executive Functioning | Season 6, Episode 3
In this episode we sit down with Speech-Language Pathologist and executive functioning expert, Sarah Ward to discuss strategies to support the development of executive functions at home and school. Sarah starts off by giving a brief overview of what “executive functioning” means in everyday life then jumps into practical and effective ways parents, caregivers, teachers, and therapists can support students as they develop these skills.
Sarah Ward, MS, CCC-SLP is the Co-Director of Cognitive Connections, LLP in Massachusetts. She has over 25 years of experience in diagnostic evaluations, treatment and case management of children, adolescents and adults with a wide range of developmental and acquired brain-based learning difficulties and behavioral problems. Sarah is a dedicated clinician and internationally recognized expert on executive function skills who presents seminars and workshops across the globe on the programs and strategies she has developed. She has a proven track record for translating complex ideas into practical strategies that work to improve executive function skills.
Links:
Sarah's website: Cognitive Connections
Sponsors:
Stephanie Landis (00:06):
Hello and welcome to Unbabbled, a podcast that navigates the world of special education, communication, delays and learning differences. We are your host, Stephanie Landis and Meredith Krimmel, and we’re certified speech language pathologist who spend our days at the parish school in Houston helping children find their voices and connect with the world around them. For my family, Tex-Mex is the way to go. It pleases everyone in the family, and that is one of the reasons we are so excited to have this episode sponsored by the original Mexican Cafe. The original Mexican Cafe is the longest continually operating restaurant on Galveston Island, still at its original location. It’s located on the corner of 14th and Market in Galveston’s, beautiful historic district. They have two stories of dining area perfect for casual dining, business lunches, large groups, or a night out on the town. They also offer a full bar and catering.
(00:58):
To learn more about the original Mexican cafe, visit their website at www.theoriginalgalveston.com or come and visit them in person for some delicious Tex-Mex, your family will leave happy as well. As parents, we know how important it’s to find someone you trust to care for your children’s dental needs Kids 360 Pediatric Dentistry is a family-owned boutique practice where your little ones can truly feel safe and at ease while receiving the highest quality of care. Located in Richmond, Texas, Dr. Maori a parody is a board certified pediatric dentist specialist with a decade of experience with compassion and honesty. She and her team provide care for infants, children, teens, and patients with special healthcare needs in their nurturing environment. Every child will receive personalized treatment tailored to their unique needs. In addition, they specialize in offering care for children with physical, emotional, developmental, cognitive, and sensory challenges. Dr.
(01:58):
Parity is always ready and willing to listen to questions and concerns, to share some laughter, and to partner with you to care for your children. For more information, visit their website at www kids 360 pediatric dentistry.com or email them at info at kids 360 pediatric dentistry.com to get all your kids dental needs met. In this episode, we sit down with speech language pathologists and executive functioning expert Sarah Ward to discuss strategies to support the development of executive functions at home and school. Sarah is the co-director of Cognitive Connections in Massachusetts where she has over 25 years of experience in diagnostic evaluations and treatment. Sarah is an internationally recognized expert who presents seminars and workshops across the globe on the programs and strategies she has developed. Sarah has a proven track record of translating these big complex ideas into practical strategies that work to improve executive function skills. She starts off our conversation by giving a brief overview of what executive functioning means in everyday life. Then she jumps straight into those practical and effective ways that parents, caregivers, teachers, and therapists can support students as they develop these skills. I hope this episode gives you at least one way to make a positive change at home or school. As I mentioned later in the episode, following Sarah’s ideas has made a huge impact not only on my therapy but my home life. And I’m hopeful it could do the same for you.
(03:35):
Welcome today. We are so excited to have our guest, Sarah Ward here. She’s the keynote speaker of our annual luncheon at the parish school and an expert in executive functions. So welcome, we’re excited to have you.
Sarah Ward (03:49):
Thank you so much. I’m really excited to be here today and to present this afternoon and this evening for everyone. One
Stephanie Landis (03:54):
Of the things that I find the most difficult to explain to parents is what executive functioning is. It’s so tricky, so can you explain it for us?
Sarah Ward (04:04):
Sure. So my favorite definition of what executive function is, is very simple. It’s getting stuff done really. I mean in its most simplistic a thing because the fact of the matter is every single day we have to get stuff done, get stuff done, whether it’s eating breakfast, whether it’s getting dressed, making sure that you get gas into the car as an adult, making sure that you are to work on time, that you have the materials you need, that you’ve paid the bill for our children. It’s that you’ve got your homework done, that you brought the things home that you needed to get the stuff done. So really the easiest definition is get stuff done. What makes it a little more complicated is what do you need to do to get stuff done? And so that’s where I think executive function is really interesting. So my favorite way of explaining it is that so many times we talk about executive function challenges in the sense of, oh boy, maybe my child is having a hard time packing their backpack, or my child’s having a hard time carrying out a morning routine, or they don’t sense the passage of time and I have to tell them 10 different ways and things to get things done in a certain amount of time they have trouble following the direction, making their bed, any of those things.
(05:16):
The fact of the matter is a lot of those are actually what we call the product or the output of the executive system. It’s not actually the process of what you do to get stuff done. And so executive function is really about the process that happens that enables you to do those specific
Stephanie Landis (05:33):
Skills, and it’s all internal and it all happens so fast.
Sarah Ward (05:36):
Absolutely. So the fact of the matter is, the biggest thing that happens is for example, and I love to use this one, any one of you that might be listening to this podcast at home, maybe as you’re listening, you run this movie through your mind and the movie through your mind says something, I need to quickly throw the wash into the dryer because I need to wear those favorite pants to my exercise class tonight. I need to take the hamburger out and let it defrost because we’re serving burgers and then I’m going to walk the dog around the block. And then what I was going to do is sit down at my computer and I need to work on that proposal before my meeting this afternoon at two o’clock. And all of a sudden your brain goes, oh, no, actually I need to do quite a bit of preparation for that meeting, which means I don’t think I have time to walk the dog.
(06:22):
So if I don’t have time to walk the dog, I’ll just let the dog out. That’ll give me an additional 20 or so minutes to prepare for that meeting and I’ll walk the dog afterwards. That feels much better. So the point being that in a single moment we run this entire movie through our head of how’s it going to go from where I am now? What are all the things that I have to do to get to the point of that successful done? And we can envision in our minds what it looks like, what it feels like, how we’re moving the materials we need. And if we don’t like the way it looks and feels, then we can change the plan. That’s what allows us to come up with that plan B thinking and say, okay, better not walk the dog. And by the way, if you aren’t doing this thing called executive function and you are not running that movie through your head, then what happens is you listen to this podcast and you check your social media, you make yourself a second tap of coffee, maybe you just play with the dog and then you sit down to do the proposal and before you realize it, your pants are soaking wet in the laundry, the dogs pee in and you go to make burgers and the hamburger’s frozen.
(07:31):
So you have to be able to constantly run that movie through your head, and if not, then you’re just sort of reacting in the moment. So to come back, really big picture, our goal as parents and as educators is to help our students be able to create that imagery and to pre-plan and to see how’s it going to go before they actually go and carry out that specific task. And so that’s a large component of executive function and something that we refer to and call it being mind miming or just really envisioning the plan of how you’re going to get stuff done. Would a
Meredith Krimmel (08:08):
Good step to start be narrating that picture and that movie for someone who’s struggling, for instance, like a child who struggles to create that movie in their mind, what a good first step would be to narrate it for them and kind of walk them through all the steps?
Sarah Ward (08:21):
The answer is sort of, it’s a really great question. So the first thing is is that I think a lot of times we do give kids directions. So when we give a direction and we say, okay, and I’ll put this in a bigger picture of something. So very typical direction and something we often say is create a routine for a child. Routines are really important and routines are important, but routines aren’t important just because they create structure, routines actually create the basis of executive function. So let me back up and give this in the bigger picture of things. So if you’re a parent and you say, okay, honey, as soon as your show is over, go upstairs, brush your teeth and put on your pajamas and we’ll come read to you. Okay, quick look, your show’s over, turn off the tv. Alright, honey, now go upstairs.
(09:09):
You need to get your pajamas. We only have about 10 minutes before it’s time for bed. We don’t want to be up too late because you’re going to be tired. Okay, quick, let’s go brush your teeth. All right, now your teeth are brushed. Go into your bedroom, get your pajamas. The problem is when you are doing all that queuing, you are actually the one that’s running the movie in your mind, not the child. So one of the better ways is, as opposed to just narrating it, now we’re going to go upstairs and we’re going to get our pajamas. It’s actually better to cue kids with what we call visual language and have a visual word. So here’s two little magic tricks. The first magic trick is it’s more effective to say, imagine you’re upstairs and you’re sitting on your bed and you’re ready for bed.
(09:54):
What do you look like? And start to ask that question. If you were in the bathroom and you were getting ready for bed, huh? What do you see yourself doing? And you always want to make sure your language has a visual word. What do you see? What do you picture? What do you envision? Hey, mark, if we’re going to be out the door for baseball and you’re standing at the door and you’re ready to go, what do you see you’re wearing? What do you see is in your hands? And you want to begin to coach that? Now some kids don’t know, and actually it’s a fascinating, and I think it’s an important question as parents to ask your children. One of the first things when families come to me, and if I’m interviewing a family or a child, I will say, when you read a book, do the words on the page make an image in your mind?
(10:40):
So for some kids, that’s a really good indicator whether they are able to make imagery and to visualize themselves because some students don’t create mental imagery. So that’s something we want to know. And if they don’t, then we have to teach it. But then I often say to students, well, if you’re downstairs and mom says to go upstairs and get your shoes even though the child’s downstairs, where in your room do you see going to get your shoes? You want to see if they can envision the space even though they’re not actually in that space. So to answer your question as opposed to just narrating it, one of the first tricks is to use a visual word in your language. What would you look like? What do you see? What do you picture? If you have that, what do you imagine is in your hands?
(11:27):
And we want to start to create things that get kids to visualize. Now here’s another thing, and this is my magic trick. I always love to talk about when we are transitioning from one situation to a future situation that requires something called situational awareness or situational intelligence. And the features of situational awareness makes a lot of sense. Are we put it into the acronym of Stop and read the room. Because the features of stop are space. You have to be aware of the space. T stands for time. You have to be aware of the time. O stands for the objects, the objects you need. And P stands for people. You have to read the room to see what other people are doing. But even more importantly is you have to read the room to know in any given situation, what is your specific role. So for example, if I’m downstairs and I’m watching TV space, I’m in the living room, I’m watching TV from seven to seven 30, I’m watching, I don’t know, whatever.
(12:28):
My show SpongeBob is objects. I’m in my shorts and T-shirt and people right now, if you think of it, we call this a role or a job. I’m being a TV watcher. Now as soon as mom says, and here’s that part of a routine, it’s time for bed. Essentially what the routine does. If I say, okay, honey, it’s time for bed. As soon as your show is over, go upstairs and brush your teeth and put on your pajamas. I’ve just taught executive function because I’ve taught that child to shift their situational awareness while I’m going from space downstairs to upstairs time. Well, there’s a time cue. It’s when my show is over objects. Right now I’m in my shorts and t-shirt, but I’m going to be changing. And now I’m seeing that in my mind I’m going to be wearing pajamas and I’m a TV watcher right now, but as soon as I go upstairs, I need to be a pajama wearer, if you will.
(13:22):
So here’s the second magic trick. Every single time we shift a situation, we shift our role. And when our role changes, we generally have different objects. This is a magic trick that we call job talk. So any action that you want a child to do, if you want them to brush their teeth, don’t just say, go upstairs and brush your teeth. It’s far more effective to say, I need you to be a toothbrusher because the minute I say toothbrusher, that child has to think, oh, well, what does a toothbrusher look like? If it’s a job of a toothbrusher, what objects does a toothbrusher need and what will they be doing? So I have to start to visualize that. I wouldn’t say to a child necessarily, go pack your bag. Oh, you finished out your homework. You need to be a bag packer. I have to think about, well, what does a bag packer look like?
(14:13):
What does a bag packer do? And we really joke, we kind of call this the earth strategy. You can put er on the end of everything. So instead of saying to your child, empty the dishwasher, I need you to be the dish emptier instead of wipe off the counters, you need to be a counter cleaner instead of take out the recycling. I need you today’s recycler. And it really is a magic trick because it helps you as the adult reduce your language, but it gives kids agency and ownership to get stuff done. It kind of goes back to that. So that’s why we really love this idea of job talk.
Stephanie Landis (14:45):
So many times in the classroom just having a checklist of things to do, we’re like, well, we put the checklist of things to put in their backpack up. And I’m like, they’re not looking at it. It’s not doing anything. But just even switching to having a picture of them with their completed backpack and all of their stuff and referring back to it of picturing themselves with their backpack completed definitely shifts how they’re able to then take the ownership, like you said, and start picturing what it actually looks like in their brain and helps them more than just having that checklist.
Sarah Ward (15:18):
Absolutely, because there’s a couple of things. First of all, the checklist when it comes to executive function interventions, ironically, it’s where we end the intervention. It’s not where we start. And I think that’s kind of a big shift. And first of all, one of the things is, is that executive function always starts with imagery. A checklist is verbal words, and then some people say, yeah, but I put a little picture on it. So I put a little picture of a backpack, I put a little picture of shoes, I put a little picture of a headband, all those things. But the fact of the matter is, is that’s still a verbal checklist with pictures. So the fact of the matter is that if you have an image of a backpack and maybe you have an image of the actual items that go in the backpack, I can visually see it as a photograph.
(16:09):
When I see that photograph, it instantly has to trigger for me in my brain, well, if that’s what my bag looks like, then where do I need to go to get those items? I need to go upstairs and get the folder that’s on my desk. I need to go into the kitchen to get the water bottle, and it forces my brain to create the mental imagery of how I am moving my body through time and space. And so what we find is it actually photographs develop the miming and that pre rehearsal kids tend to read the checklist, and when they read the checklist, then they’re not actually engaging that pre-visualization of movement. And we really want it to be a mind miming and we want it to be a movement through space and time. But the other thing that’s really fascinating is that so many times we talk about working memory, and especially when we talk about students with executive challenges, oftentimes they are described as having sometimes reduced working memory.
(17:12):
Not all. Some kids actually with executive challenges have really high working memory. I mean, that can be a challenge too. I mean, it’s a little bit of both, but the point being that we often talk about volume when it comes to working memory. What we talk about far less is as an adult or a teacher parent, how much time do you have to get information in a child’s working memory? And we statistically know it’s three seconds. So when I give you a direction, I have literally less than three seconds for you to get that entire direction in your head. So if I have a picture checklist that says, in your backpack, you need to have a homework folder, a composition book, your agenda book a water bottle, your keys, your phone, your fidget toy, I mean whatever it is, it takes longer than three seconds for that student to read that word, convert the word to what it’s going to look like, and then go from the word to the imagery of what they’re going to do.
(18:12):
When you show a photograph, you can get the entire gestalt of what it is that you want them to do in less than three seconds in their mind. And so what happens is is that photographs access working memory faster. That’s another reason why we use photographs because the student can more rapidly see what it is and then quickly come up with the plan as opposed to by the time they’ve read to the first three or four things, now they’re at not just capacity, but there’s no more time to get the information in. So I have to give up something and I might forget what you just told me to do.
Stephanie Landis (18:46):
And that makes so much sense. As you’re talking about imagery, I realized after listening to a lot of what you say, that when I even just go to make a grocery list, I first picture my refrigerator and my pantry, and then I start making a list from there, and then I write my list in the mental image of the grocery store. Absolutely. Which is also why it throws me off as an adult to have things moved in the grocery store because I’m like, well, now I forgot half the things on my list because it’s not in the right spot.
Sarah Ward (19:12):
Absolutely.
Stephanie Landis (19:13):
And my brain works the grocery store. I pre-AP the grocery store, and I’m watch myself move through space buying the groceries as I’m making the list.
Sarah Ward (19:22):
That’s exactly
Stephanie Landis (19:23):
Right. I was like, I never really thought about that’s how I do it. And I write the list that way. And it took my husband a while to figure out, and he was like, oh, your list is in order. And I was like, don’t you do that? And he was like, no.
Sarah Ward (19:34):
And it’s interesting because again, the checklist, I mean the most important thing is that checklists come from mental imagination. So for example, if you look at your calendar and on your calendar you put, I have a meeting at 10 o’clock, your brain doesn’t just read meeting at 10 o’clock. That cues the entire movie and it can cue for you, well, I know at that meeting I need to have a special cord. I know at that meeting I need to bring in a particular folder. I see myself at that meeting that I need this. And you use that imagery to then write down the items that you need. And so it is just so important that we really start by teaching our students to visualize, and then we can create that checklist with them. But you’ve got to make sure that the checklist we would prefer instead of a checklist, it’s actually a true photograph.
(20:25):
So photograph what they need to go in the backpack, and we like to make backpack tags. That’s a really great way to see it. If for example, and this is one of my favorite ones, if you say to a child, okay, it’s Tuesday and it’s your day to do the recycling, don’t forget to take the cans all the way out to the end of the sidewalk, but not on the sidewalk. And they have to be four feet apart. And sweetie, don’t forget to make them four feet from the mailbox because otherwise the mailman won’t deliver them. I guarantee your child just heard the classic.
(20:54):
I mean, it’s too much language. And the parent is the one that’s visualizing that movement through time and space. Now, if you gave them a checklist where you just said to them, take the cans out and do all that, again, you’re dependent upon the child reading that checklist. Far more effective is to, with the student, go through the actions of the recycling, grab your phone, and when the cans are where you want them to be at the end of the driveway, but not on the sidewalk, four feet apart and four feet from the mailbox, take a photograph of that and then put it in a central location and say to your student, it’s Tuesday your turn to be the recycler. And you just point to the picture. Because now when that student looks at the picture, they have to engage, oh yeah, right? I have to take the cans to the end. Oh yeah, right. They’re supposed to be four feet apart. So photographs help students to learn how to create that movement through time and space, which is what we have to be able to do.
Meredith Krimmel (21:56):
The photographs has changed my son’s life, we did little bag tags of his water bottle and his glasses because he would come home regularly without both. And so we just took pictures of his actual glasses, his actual water bottle, and we started sending the same water bottle every day. So it always looked the same. And surprisingly, the water bottles started coming home. And then this year we switched to a different water bottle because a year they got little gross and we haven’t made the new tag yet. And now we have lost five water bottles already.
Sarah Ward (22:30):
So this is really fascinating. I’m really glad you brought this up actually as an example, because sometimes the pushback I will get from parents about using photographs is they might say, well, the thing is that you don’t understand, Sarah. My child’s actually a little bit rigid. And they would say, well, I don’t want to wear that shirt every single day. So for example, if you want your child to follow a morning routine, I might have a photograph of what dressed and ready for school Looks like your hair is brushed. And we would have a picture of them wearing their shorts and T-shirt and their sneakers and their backpack on and their lunchbox. So that we know prepared for school means that you’re dressed, you have your lunch, your backpack, and you have your shoes. And some parents will say, oh yeah, but my child doesn’t always wear those shoes.
(23:17):
Or My child doesn’t always wear that. And then we get into a battle about that or they say, well, I can’t do it. Or they’ll say, I don’t want to wear that shirt every single day, or maybe it’s even I get to wear that shirt every single day. And as the parent, you think, oh no, that shirt’s in the laundry and it’s got a spot in and we’re not wearing it today. Okay, so here’s the larger point about this. And so now you’ve switched with this water bottle. Okay, so one of the things that we know is that executive function and this miming of the future is actually a processing skill, and it has a specific name and it has the word mi in it, which is why we call it mim it. It’s called mimetic ideational information processing. And that’s a huge name, but mimetic ideational, you’re miming the idea in your head.
(24:05):
So you’re literally acting out or rehearsing or miming what that’s going to look like. And it is a processing skill. So what’s fascinating about processing and more and more we’re seeing students are referred for executive function challenges. And let me back up for one minute here. So if you have attention deficit disorder, for example, you definitely have executive function challenges. They go hand in hand. Similarly, if you are an individual or a child that is on the autism spectrum, you’ll also struggle with executive function. They go hand in hand more and more. We are seeing students that are coming in with executive challenges that don’t meet the criterion of attention deficit, nor do they meet the criterion of being on the spectrum and not always, but often they present with either slow processing speed and slow processing. Speed could be just a relative weakness of processing speed.
(25:00):
It doesn’t necessarily have to be lower slow in terms of true IQ standards. And actually we see the opposite too. Kids that have extremely fast processing speed, I find it ironic that sometimes my kids that are the fastest processors and sometimes my kids that have the most gifted learners actually struggle the most with executive function. So that being said, executive function in this mimetic processing is in fact a processing skill. And what we know about processing speed, and I think this is sort of just fascinating, the tests that measure processing speed on standardized IQ tests don’t measure your ability to process information, which seems so funny, right? Because you think, okay, well, we’re talking about processing information. I mean, that’s not even what the tests really do. And so how does this all relate back to the fact that I want to wear that shirt every single day?
(25:54):
So here’s the point. In our world, everything that we do really has a routine component and a complex decision. So for example, there is a routine of getting dressed and it’s very predictable. Every morning you’re going to put on undergarments and you’re going to put on your shorts and your shirt or your pants or in whatever it is, and shoes, and you may or may not accessorize and you may or may not wear outerwear. That is just the predictable routine called getting dressed. And then what you do is every morning you go to get dressed, you very quickly run the movie through your mind and make a complex decision. Well, what is the weather going to be like today? If it’s going to be cold, then I’m going to wear long sleeves, even though the photograph you showed me has short sleeves, and if it’s going to be colder, I’m going to wear my boots because those are shoes.
(26:45):
It’s just that in this future situation, I’m going to look the same, but different and same, but different is the key way in which we develop cognitive flexibility. So for example, if you have a student where you have a photograph of what dressed looks like and the child has their hair brushed and out and they’ve got their lunchbox and their backpack and their clothing and their shoes, I can use that same photograph and draw boxes around those features. We call that feature, blocking the feature, blocking establishes the routine features of a task. And then I can say to that student, guess what? Today we’re going to basketball practice, which means when you’re dressed for basketball practice, you’re going to look exactly the same but different. So same thing, your body will still be ready, but instead of your hair being brushed out, how might it look different at basketball?
(27:45):
And now I’m running that movie through my head. I would want my hair up in a ponytail because I don’t want it to fall in my face and feel sweaty. Okay, if you’re going to basketball, how will your clothes look the seam, but different? Well, same thing. I’m wearing a shirt, but it would be a T-shirt. Same thing, pants, but it would be shorts because it’s basketball. Okay, I take a lunch to school. Well, I might not take a lunch to basketball, but lunch really belongs to the feature of nutrition slash hydration. So I might bring a water bottle and a granola bar to my basketball practice. I have a bag for school, but when I go to basketball, I still need a bag, it seemed, but different. It’s my basketball bag. If we were have that photograph of your son with the water bottles, we would want to draw a box around the water bottle and call it the bottle and talk about how might the bottle, today’s bottle look the same, but different. And so that’s helping to create imagery. It’s helping to create complex thinking from routine decisions, and it’s creating cognitive flexibility. And
Stephanie Landis (28:48):
Cognitive flexibility is an area that might be a difficulty with executive dysfunction.
Sarah Ward (28:52):
Absolutely, absolutely. And again, it is because cognitive flexibility requires you to be flexible based upon essentially in many ways, context. The context is going to change. So I have to be able to envision that future context of how will it be the same but different in its most simplistic example. Let’s just do this one. I am not from the Houston area. So here I am recording this podcast and I can go on to ways and I can look and see, huh, fabulous. It is 30 minutes to get from here to the airport, and if I have a flight to catch, I can plan my time accordingly. And however, if I am leaving here, the school at 4 45, 5 o’clock, and I’m going to the Houston Airport, good luck. Yeah.
(29:42):
See, and I knew, I wasn’t sure you were going to say that. I don’t know what direction I’m going. Am I driving into traffic or am I going, it doesn’t matter. Everywhere. Everywhere, everywhere in Houston traffic. So what happens is all of a sudden I have to run that movie through my mind that well, my plan is going to be the same, go to Houston and to the airport, but different now because I have to account for that traffic and therefore my plan has to change. So we ask kids to be cognitively flexible all the time. So maybe for example, if you were at basketball practice and basketball practice ran a little over and we hung out and chatted with our friends, and then we went out for yogurt afterwards, and we get home now and all of a sudden we’re home and I don’t have an hour for iPad time, I only have a half hour.
(30:34):
Okay, all of a sudden my night is going to be the same but different because of the features of what happened with basketball practice. And so it really is the magic phrase to say to students, well, here how it is the same but different. Here’s what I was picturing. Tell me what you were picturing. How is that the same but different? Because a lot of times kids have one image in their mind and they don’t have the ability to be flexible about it. So I’ll give you one of my favorites really. One of the ways that I got into the field is my daughter who has a DHD and is dyslexic. When she was little, she was what was deemed an explosive child. She was the kid who would have a monster tantrum that was completely disproportionate to what triggered it. And I just think, oh my gosh, why are you melting down over this?
(31:26):
This is just so seemingly benign. And it was really overwhelming. And I was already a speech and language pathologist and working in the field. And at the time, Ross Green, who wrote the book, the Explosive Child, and is well known for his work with collaborative problem solving great program, really identified that students who are often explosive have lagging executive skills. And my daughter had lagging executive skills. And here’s a really great example. She would, I don’t know, maybe watch a YouTube or something and see a really cool braid. So it’s time for school. And she has in her mind, we are doing that braid this morning before we go to school. And newsflash, we don’t have time to do a fancy braid. Okay? So if you think about this whole idea of routine and complex, the routine is that we do our hair before school.
(32:24):
The complex decision is, and you and I do this all the time, I mean the complex decision, am I going to blow dry and curl my hair this morning? Am I going to do a refresh? Am I going to pull it up into a bun and hope it looks nice? Or am I going for messy bun and getting stuff done kind of thing. I mean, we do that based upon the complex decision of how much time do I have? What event am I going to? Do I have an interview with a boss, or am I just hanging with kids teaching today? Yeah, I’m wearing the messy bun. It doesn’t matter. But kids don’t have always the ability to run that movie through their head and to be flexible. So that’s where executive function relates to cognitive flexibility. So in this example with my daughter being able to help her see that the routine is your hair is done and that might be brushed out or braided, and then getting her to understand that there are features of braids, there’s a fast braid, there’s a double braid, there’s a fancy braid, and then there’s an over the top.
(33:27):
Give it a try, and who knows if it’ll work braid. And we love to teach kids those skills and features of things. And I love to have parents and even educators go to Home Depot, whatever it is, and get all those paint chip things of all the colors and put the ranges of even breakfasts out. So I mean, I have another girl who, she was the oldest of six, and her mom said, okay, we’re going to make some independences here, go downstairs and make yourself breakfast. And she would go downstairs and she would open the cabinet and stare. She couldn’t make a decision. And then mom would come downstairs and Can you imagine me six kids getting ready for school? You do the imagery, what the house is like. And Emma looked at her mom and said, mom, can you make pancakes? Mom’s like, no, no.
(34:14):
It’s not a pancake morning. This is not a pancake morning. But the features of morning are when you are making breakfast, is it a fast morning? Is it a morning I have a little time, or is it a slow morning? And if it’s a fast morning, then I’m choosing something that’s quick and portable. It’s a protein bar. It’s the prepackaged cereal in the cup. It’s a Go-Gurt. Frozen waffles. Frozen waffles every day. Absolutely. If it’s a little time morning, I might actually be making cereal. Maybe I’m cutting up a little fruit. Maybe it is a smoothie. If it’s a slow morning, we’re making pancakes, we’re making breakfast quesadillas, whatever it is. So one of the things that we did for Emma in this example is we actually made a visual breakfast menu based on features. So across the top of the menu we had, is it a fast morning, a little bit of time warning or a slow morning when Emma, and then we would put actual photographs of the types of things related to fast versus a little time.
(35:16):
So Emma would go down, we had it on the inside of the cabinet. She would open the cabinet and say, it’s a fast morning. I’m choosing something portable. I think I’ll grab a granola bar or protein bar, whatever it is. And all of a sudden she was independent. So with my daughter being able to say, oh, I got it. You had in your mind you were a fancy YouTube, give it a go braid. But because it is a fast morning, I was picturing a get it done braid. So we have to find our images weren’t the same. When would we have time to do the fancy, give it a go braid? Let’s do that as soon as we get home from school. So you’re not really saying, we can’t do that braid right now. You’re helping the child to develop context, to develop situational awareness, to mime it and to understand features, to develop cognitive flexibility. That was a long-winded answer. It
Meredith Krimmel (36:14):
Was perfect. It was a great answer. I’m like, can she come be at my house? I know, that’s what I’m thinking. Well, and also running short on time, and I think we could talk to you forever. You have so much insight and advice, and I don’t know if you noticed we’re over here just nodding our heads nonstop. Clearly we can relate to what you’re saying.
Sarah Ward (36:32):
So I was giggling because in my mind right before we went on the air, we were chatting about this idea of structure versus routine and how hard it is for students when there’s the structure of the day to suddenly it’s the weekend. And I have a mom who has a DHD, and inevitably every time I lecture, parents will say to me, oh my gosh, this is me. How can I help my kids? And she had a session with me the other day and she said, I’m in panic mode because we have a 10 day vacation coming up and I don’t know what to do. And kids oftentimes will kind of fall apart on the weekends because they’re missing that structure. So one of a really great trick, like the breakfast menu is to actually, it’s hard for kids sometimes to visualize what they’re going to do.
(37:18):
So when you say go upstairs and play, which is expecting them to visualize themselves going from one situation to a future situation, they don’t really see what they’re going to do upstairs. So it’s great to talk about features of activities. Well, there are arts and crafts activities. There are indoor building activities. There are outdoor physical activities. There’s outdoor sports activities. There’s indoor baking activities. And to have an actual photograph of a kind of thing, maybe you can use sharpies to draw in fun shoes, or maybe you’re going to make animals out of waffles and strawberries. I mean like a fun craft for baking. The reason why I love that is when a child looks at a menu and says, oh, I’m going outside and I see a visual of an obstacle course. I see a visual of sidewalk chalk. I see a visual of maybe a fort made outside. That’s where we can say, oh, interesting. Sidewalk chalk. Remember you saw that really interesting YouTube where they tried to draw a river out of sidewalk chalk and it tried to fake someone out that they were falling in the river. Maybe that’s what we could do today. That would be the same, but different. So it helps to spark students’ imagination and to mime what might be different. So when kids are bored, bored menus is a great way to handle that lack of structure a little bit.
Stephanie Landis (38:40):
I love that idea too, because my daughter inevitably picks the biggest, most elaborate, messy thing that she could do, and we’re like, we really only have 30 minutes and that’s going to take three hours. It is not a science experiment time. So I love also the idea of telling her, this is a long time. This is when we have a short time. This is when we have five minutes for you to go do something on your own.
Sarah Ward (39:05):
Absolutely. If I decide I want to do a baking activity and I only have 30 minutes, I may not get the whole cupcakes in the oven and get them out thing, but I could make, I love the things where they put strawberries and turn them into ladybugs. I mean, I could maybe do that one because that could be done, and I’m going to end on one thing. This is a good place for us to end. So many times when kids are engaged in activities, stopping can be equally as hard as starting, and we have to stop. And I really, I don’t want to, the word stop is actually anxiety producing. It creates all or nothing thinking. And Jessica Han, who is an anxiety expert, I love one of her tricks, and it’s one of the things we really use a lot in executive function is the magic phrase as apparent is never reuse the word stop.
(39:56):
Always replace the word stop with the word pause. So we have 30 minutes and oh, I see you’re making ladybugs. We have about 10 minutes left. What would be a good pause spot? So we are going to say, oh, we’re going to put this here. Let’s pause there. Because kids have learned what pause means. Pause means you put a pause and then you can come back to it. Now if a child can come back to it, then you can say, we have only 10 minutes. What would a 10 minute plan be? And really start to ask what that 10 minute plan would be. Don’t just say 10 minute warning because when you say 10 minute warning, you’re picturing 10 minutes, not the child. So asking, what would your 10 minute plan be or saying, we’re going to pause and then we’ll come back, really reduces some of those explosive behaviors.
Meredith Krimmel (40:42):
There’s been so much great information in here, and I’m like, I’m going to pick two things to do at home, and then I’m going to try those. And when I master, I’m going to come back and listen again. But I am committed to the job talk. I think that would change our morning routine, especially with filling water bottles. I don’t know why that is something that it just, we get hung up on it every morning. You’re a bottle
Sarah Ward (41:02):
Filler. You’re a bottle
Meredith Krimmel (41:02):
Filler. I
Sarah Ward (41:03):
Love that. So the only thing about job talk is you have to be a little judicious about it because it is a magic trick. And sometimes your kids will be on you, they’ll get it. And it works good on husbands too. I’m just saying.
Stephanie Landis (41:18):
I will say two things real fast. Two things that I learned from you that have totally changed our lives at home. One of ’em was using a working clock and just getting dry erase markers and drawing on a clock during the get home from school and homework routine time totally changed our lives. And my daughter started doing projects and you have to do them at home from school. And I made her go through, get Ready, do, done. And one day we were on our third project of three months, and she was like, oh, why do you always make me start with the end first? And I’m like, because the first time we did this and I didn’t think about it, we went to the store four times and I have learned, but she was just like, oh, why do you always make me do this
Sarah Ward (42:02):
Start? I
Stephanie Landis (42:03):
Have learned. So doing those two things at home, even just the simplest of the working clock, it totally changed our bedtime and our getting home from school. So thank you so much.
Sarah Ward (42:14):
Stephen Covey, who of course always start with the end in mind, but I don’t have his exact quote, but he makes a great quote that we do everything twice, once in our mind as we imagine it, and then once in reality when we do it. And I really think that is how we get stuff done. We create that imagery to develop that blueprint, and then we put the blueprint into reality. And that’s what we have to be doing with our students and supporting them in developing that executive skills so they can get stuff done. Yeah. I love
Stephanie Landis (42:45):
It. Well, thank you so much. I’m really excited to hear you continue to talk at the luncheon and other events that we have on campus. And like I said, we love your work here at the Parish school. It’s been a huge
Sarah Ward (42:57):
Honor to meet day. Well, thank you for the invite. I got to do the tour this morning. I’m just blown away. I mean, it just makes my heart melt because the school’s exquisite so many strategies in place in the classrooms, and it’s really just all around developing play and fostering independence and plays the catalyst for executive function skills. So it’s really a lovely, lovely place. I feel honored to have been invited. We’re so happy to have you here.
Meredith Krimmel (43:30):
Thank you for listening to the Unbabbled podcast. For more information on today’s episode, please see our episode description. For more information on the parish school, visit parish school.org. If you’re not already, don’t forget to subscribe to the Un Babbled Podcast on your app of choice. And if you like what you’re hearing, be sure to leave a rating and review. A special thank you to Andy Williams, Joanna Rissmiller, and Molly Weisselberg for all their hard work behind the scenes. Thanks again for listening.